Prabhupäda: So this is the process of ceto-darpaëa-märjanam [Cc. Antya 20.12], to cleanse the material dust from the mirror of our mind. The whole process is to dust out the dirty things which we have accumulated by our material association and therefore to revive our spiritual consciousness, or Kåñëa consciousness. From Bhagavad-gétä we are studying about the process of life by which we can revive our Kåñëa consciousness. There is no need of external help for reviving Kåñëa consciousness. You have got Kåñëa consciousness dormant in yourself. It is the quality of the self. So the, we have simply to invoke by this process.

Kåñëa-bhakti nitya-siddha sädhya kabhu naya. This Kåñëa consciousness is an eternal fact. It is nothing that by this organization we are imposing upon you something extra. No. It is within you. It is within every living entity. Any living entity-never mind whether he is human being or animal... When Lord Caitanya was singing this Hare Kåñëa Hare Kåñëa Kåñëa Kåñëa Hare Hare, He was passing through jungles, forests, and the tigers, the elephants, the stags, and all, I mean to, forest animals, they joined. They joined. It is such a thing. Of course, it depends on the pure-hearted chanting. As we become... This is the process. As we become advanced in this chanting method, similarly, our heart becomes freed from all the dirty things of material contact. So even the animals can be captivated by this chanting, what to speak of human beings.

So in our practical life Kåñëa advises how to invoke this Kåñëa consciousness. He says,

yasya sarve samärambhäù
käma-saìkalpa-varjitäù
jïänägni-dagdha-karmäëaà
tam ähuù paëòitaà budhäù

(loud conversation going on in background) Ask them to stop. Why do they come and talk nonsense?

Yasya sarve samärambhäù. You are not forbidden to execute your duties. We are not after stopping the general process of material activities. That is not our mission. The whole thing is that we have to act everything in Kåñëa consciousness, Kåñëa consciousness. Just like... It is very easy to understand. Everybody has got some vocation of his life. But what is their consciousness? Their consciousness is that "I am engaged in this business, I am engaged in this service, because I have to maintain my family," "I have to maintain myself," or "I have to satisfy the government," or "I have to satisfy somebody else." This is our consciousness. Nobody is free from such consciousness.

Everybody must have some consciousness. Without consciousness, nothing can be done. One who has no consciousness, he cannot do anything nicely. If his consciousness is disturbed, then his work cannot be... Just like a madman. A madman cannot do anything nicely because his consciousness is disturbed. So we, similarly, if we change the process only, that "I am, to satisfy Kåñëa..." Just like we are doing everything, with that idea, to satisfy somebody else, or at least myself, for my satisfaction. This process has to be changed to Kåñëa consciousness. That should be done. This process has to be changed into Kåñëa consciousness. Therefore Lord Kåñëa says, yasya sarve samärambhäù.

(aside:) Those who want to come, we can invite them. Come inside.

Yasya sarve samärambhäù: "Whatever activities you may do, do it," but käma-saìkalpa-varjitäù, käma-saìkalpa-varjitäù: "don't be carried away by käma." Käma means for your own satisfaction, käma. The word, Sanskrit word käma, is used for lust, for desire, for sense satisfaction. So Lord Kåñëa recommends that, "Don't do it for satisfaction of your senses, for satisfaction of your lust, or for satisfaction of your desires." That is the whole thing. Whole teaching of Bhagavad-gétä is based on this principle.

The whole instruction to Arjuna is that Arjuna wanted to satisfy his senses, his senses. He wanted that, that by not fighting with the opposite party, who were composed of his relatives, brothers and brother-in-laws and father-in-laws and so many relatives. So he did not want to fight. And therefore this instruction of Bhagavad-gétä was needed by Kåñëa. The whole basic principle is this. Now, that was Kåñëa's, Arjuna's own satisfaction of the senses. Arjuna did not want to fight. Materially, it appears very nice that he is giving up his claim of kingdom for satisfying his relatives. Oh, he's very good man. But Kåñëa did not approve it. Why? Because the basic principle was Arjuna decided to satisfy his own senses. Externally it appeared very nice. But anything which is done for the satisfaction of his own senses, that is käma, käma, lust, desire.

Here it is prescribed that you can do anything. There is no harm. Whatever your business, or vocation, occupation, you are engaged, that has not to be changed. That has not to be changed. Simply your consciousness has to be changed. That's all. Käma-saìkalpa-varjitäù. How? How that consciousness can be changed? Now, jïänägni-dagdha-karmäëam. That consciousness, transferring the present self-interested consciousness to Kåñëa consciousness, requires knowledge. Requires knowledge. And what is that knowledge? That knowledge is that, "I am part and parcel of Kåñëa. I'm not different from Kåñëa. I am part and parcel. I am the superior energy of Kåñëa." That is knowledge.

Knowledge means to understand something. How this tape recorder is manufactured, if we get some knowledge, technical knowledge, that is not knowledge. That is a, of course, to have some, our occupation executed. That knowledge is temporary knowledge. But real knowledge is... This is real knowledge. The real knowledge is that when one understands convincingly that "I am part and parcel of Kåñëa." Kåñëa, or God. When we say Kåñëa, you should understand the Supreme Lord, the Absolute Truth. Kåñëa is the technical word which is meant for indicating the Absolute Truth, the Supreme Personality of Godhead, the whole, the whole pleasure, the whole attraction. These are the meaning of Kåñëa.

So we are all part and parcel of the supreme pleasure, and our pleasure... Just like my hand. This is my hand. Now, this my hand can take pleasure when it is attached with my body. My hand can take pleasure when it serves my body. It does not take pleasure by serving your body.

(aside:) This is a formality.[?] Sit here.

So therefore, because I am part and parcel of Kåñëa, my pleasure, my happiness, is dependent by serving Kåñëa just like my senses are satisfied when they are used for my purpose, not for your purpose. This is the whole, I mean to say, philosophy. I cannot be satisfied by serving you. I can be satisfied by serving me. So that me, I do not know. That is Kåñëa. That is Kåñëa. So when we begin to serve Kåñëa, because we are part and parcel... Always remember, the part and parcel, we are. Mamaiväàço jéva-loke jéva-bhütaù sanätanaù [Bg. 15.7]. In the Fifteenth Chapter you'll find, "All these living entities, they are My eternal part and parcels. Now they are detached. Now they are detached. By material contact, they are detached." So we have to... The whole process is that we have to attach again. Now we are detached. Now we have to attach again. That is Kåñëa consciousness.

That Kåñëa consciousness is within you because you are originally, eternally the part and parcel of the Supreme. Artificially, I am trying to forget it. I am trying to live independently. That is not possible. We are not independent. If we want to live independently, that means we voluntarily become dependent on the influence of material nature. That's all. Actually, we are not independent. If I think I am independent of Kåñëa, then I am dependent on the influence of material nature.

Just like, if I think that I am independent of government regulations, then I become dependent of the police force. My dependence is neither in this way or that way. So that is our mistaken. Everyone is trying to be, become independent. That is called mäyä. That is called mäyä, or illusion. Nobody can be independent. Individually, community-wise, society-wise, or nation-wise, you can extend even universal-wise-nobody can be independent. We are dependent. And this is called knowledge. When you come to the sense, that "I am dependent; I am not independent," this is called knowledge.

Now we are misguided. Jïänägni-dagdha karmäëam. In other place, you'll find, Kåñëa says,

bhoktäraà yajïa-tapasäà
sarva-loka-maheçvaram
suhådaà sarva-bhütänäà
jïätvä mäà çäntim åcchati
[Bg. 5.29]

Now, people are planning for peace in the world, but they do not know how to formulate that peace formula. You know. The United Nations are trying for the last twenty years or more than that for peace, but there is no peace actually in the world. The war is going on because they do not know.

The formula is in the Bhagavad-gétä. The Bhagavad-gétä says that bhoktäraà yajïa-tapasäà sarva-loka-maheçvaram [Bg. 5.29]. "I am the proprietor of everything. Whatever you are doing, I am the ultimate beneficiary. I have to take the result." Just like a laborer works in a factory, but who is the proprietor? The ultimate proprietor is the, the proprietor is the ultimate owner of the... So everything, whatever we do... Jïänägni-dagdha-karmäëam. Now, we are thinking that "This thing I am doing, I am the proprietor of this thing." That is a misconception. When we understand that everything, whatever we are doing, the ultimate proprietor is Kåñëa, that is Kåñëa consciousness. That is jïänägni-dagdha-karmäëam.

So we can have simply... Just like in office. In office so many people are working. Hundreds of people are working. Everyone is conscious that "Whatever we are acting, whatever profit we are making, that belongs to the proprietor." Then there is peace. As soon as the cashier thinks, "Oh, I have got so much money. I am the proprietor," then whole trouble begins. This consciousness, Kåñëa consciousness... If we understand that "I am a very rich man. I have got so much bank balance. I can use it for my sense gratification," that is käma. That is käma-räga. But if we understand that "Whatever I have got, it belongs to Kåñëa," then I am liberated person. I am liberated person. This is Kåñëa... You, you'll have the same money under your custody. It doesn't matter. But as soon as you think that "I am the proprietor of this wealth," then you are under the influence of mäyä. And as soon as you think that "Kåñëa is the proprietor of all these things," then you are free.

So käma-saìkalpa-varjitäù, jïänägni-dagdha-karmäëaà tam ähuù paëòitaà budhäù: "One who thinks like that, one who is situated in that consciousness," paëòitaà budhäù, "he is learned, and he is actually a man of knowledge." This is the whole process. Tam ähuù. Tam, he is known as the paëòita. Paëòita means one who knows things as it is, not to take a thing wrongly. So that consciousness has to be invoked, not only individually, but also community-wise, society-wise, nation-wise, all over the world. Then there will be peace. If you want real peace.

bhoktäraà yajïa-tapasäà
sarva-loka-maheçvaram
suhådaà sarva-bhütänäà
jïätvä mäà çäntim åcchati
[Bg. 5.29]

We are just trying to be philanthropic, altruistic. And we are trying to become friend of my countrymen, of my society, of my family, but that is a wrong conception. Real friend is Kåñëa. I can work on His behalf. How I can work? You try. If you actually want to do something good to your family, then you try to make all the members of your family Kåñëa conscious. Then your life will be successful. If you want to make them otherwise, without Kåñëa consciousness, then you will be serving, not serving, you will be rendering them disservice. Because any knowledge will not help your wife or children. Any knowledge, any amount of knowledge, will not help his real problem. What is his real problem we do not know. The real problem is... That we do not know. The real problem is janma-måtyu-jarä-vyädhi.

The Bhägavata says, pitä na sa syäj janané na sä syät: "One should not try to become father. One should not try to become mother." Why? Na mocayed yaù samupeta-måtyum: "One who is unable to save his children from the grip of material nature." That should be Kåñëa consciousness. If you are a responsible father, then, if you are completely in knowledge of Kåñëa consciousness, then your duty will be that "These creatures, these innocent creatures now, who are playing in my, at my home as my children, as my boys, now this life should be the last installment of his transmigration from one body to another. I shall train these boys in such a way that after this body he will have no more to go into the cycle of birth and death." That is Kåñëa consciousness.

That means you have to make yourself expert. Then you can help your children also. Then you can help your nation also. Then you can help your society also. If you are yourself ignorant, then andhä yathändhair upanéyamänäs te 'péça-tantryäm uru-dämni baddhäù.

Just like a person who is, I mean, tightly bound-up, hands and feet. Suppose we are sitting here, some people, twenty-five gentlemen, ladies, and all our hands are tightly bound-up by some rope, and if I want to make you free, although my hand is also tightly bound-up, is it possible? No. At least my hand should be free. Then I can open, I can untie, your bindings by the rope. So unless one is free man... And what is that freedom? One who is Kåñëa conscious, he is free man. And nobody is free man.

daivé hy eñä guëa-mayé
mama mäyä duratyayä
mäm eva ye prapadyante
mäyäm etäà taranti te
[Bg. 7.14]

Everyone is under the spell of material influence. Nobody's free.

And one who is, who has surrendered unto Kåñëa, one who has taken Kåñëa consciousness, mäyä has nothing to do. Mäyä cannot touch. Just like when... If you come in front of the sunlight, there is no question of darkness. There is no question of darkness if you place yourself in light, sunlight, not this artificial light. This artificial light may be extinguished at any time, but sunlight is not like that. So Kåñëa is just like sunlight. As soon as you come in front of sun, oh, there is no darkness. So there is no ignorance. So there is no mäyä. Mäyä means illusion.

So jïänägni-dagdha-karmäëaà tam ähuù paëòitaà budhäù. In this way, we have to become budha. Budha means learned, learned. And you'll find in the Tenth Chapter of Bhagavad-gétä that the Lord says who is budha. And what are the symptoms of budha. Budha means learned. What are the symptoms? What are the symptoms of mahätmä, great soul? And what are the symptoms of budha? That is described in Bhagavad-gétä. It is said that

ahaà sarvasya prabhavo
mattaù sarvaà pravartate
iti matvä bhajante mäà
budhä bhäva-samanvitäù
[Bg. 10.8]

Budha, this word, the very word, again is used, budha. So budha, one who is learned, one who is actually in sense, he's not nonsense, he's called budha.

So budha, what are the symptoms? The symptoms of budha is that ahaà sarvasya prabhavaù: he knows that Kåñëa is the fountainhead of all emanations, everything, whatever we find, everything. Anything, whatever you see.

Now, take for example, take for example the material world. The most prominent thing is, I mean to say, unity between man and woman. Now, one can inquire, "Wherefrom this attraction comes between male and female?" Not only the human society, but also in animal society, in the bird society, in any society, every living be... This is a fact. So somebody criticizes, but those who do not know Kåñëa, that Kåñëa had so many girlfriends. So they are... Some people are criticize. But one does not know that where we get this idea of having girlfriends unless the tendency is in Kåñëa? Because you can have nothing here unless that is in Kåñëa. But here it is perverted. It is polluted. And Kåñëa, it is pure consciousness, pure spiritual. That is the difference.

So one who does not know, they want to avoid something. Nothing is, I mean to, can be, can exist in this material world unless it is in Kåñëa. Janmädy asya yataù [SB 1.1.1]. So these things have to be studied very scientifically and from books like Bhagavad-gétä, Çrémad-Bhägavatam, and when he is perfectly learned, then his symptom is that he becomes a, a pure devotee of Kåñëa. Ahaà sarvasya prabhavo mattaù sarvaà pravartate [Bg. 10.8]: "I am the source, fountainhead," Kåñëa says. "I am the source and fountainhead like, of everything. One who understands this science, then he takes to Kåñëa." How? Now, budhä bhäva-samanvitäù, with full knowledge, and he becomes a devotee of Kåñëa.

Similarly, so far mahätmä... Mahätmä is a Sanskrit word which is used for great soul. That is also described in the Bhagavad-gétä.

mahätmänas tu mäà pärtha
daivéà prakåtim äçritäù
bhajanty ananya-manaso
jïätvä bhütädim avyayam
[Bg. 9.13]

Mahätmä. Who is a mahätmä? Who is a great soul? Great soul is he who is under the influence of the superior nature.

There are two kinds of nature: superior nature and inferior nature. Now we are under the influence of this inferior, material nature. And that, by Kåñëa consciousness, we shall be transferred into the superior nature. Just try to understand: a person in the prison, a person outside the prison. The government's influence is in both the places, outside the prison and inside the prison. But outside the prison, the government's rules and regulation is superior. And inside, that is inferior. So influence is there. Similarly, either in the material world or in the spiritual world, wherever you, you are, your position is marginal. You can transfer yourself either in this, under the influence of this inferior nature, or you can transfer yourself under the influence of superior nature. Your position is marginal.

Now, you are given... Because Kåñëa is full independent, and because you are also part and parcel of Kåñëa, therefore you have got the quality of independence, to make your choice whether to be under the influence of this inferior nature or to become under the influence of superior nature. But because we do not know what is that superior nature, therefore we have no other alternative than to remain in this inferior nature. This is the whole position.

Because in the world there are many philosophies. They are informing that "There is no other nature. This nature, which we have experienced, it is troublesome. Make an end of it and become void." Oh, you cannot be void because you are living entity and eternal. Na hanyate hanyamäne çarére [Bg. 2.20]. Your change of body does not mean that you are finished. No. You are continuing. Väsäàsi jérëäni. Because I change my dress, that does not mean that I am finished. So I am eternal. If I have to finish the... If I have to get rid, out of the influence of material nature, then I have to seek: "Where is my place?" If we know or do not know, then we prefer: "All right, whatever it may be, inferior or superior, let us remain here and rot." So Bhagavad-gétä gives you information of the superior nature: yad gatvä na nivartante tad dhäma paramaà mama [Bg. 15.6], na tad bhäsayate süryo na candro na pävakaù.

So we have to become Kåñëa conscious by scrutinizing, studying, this authoritative book, Çrémad Bhagavad-gétä, without having fashionable interpretation, as it is. What Kåñëa says, He says for all the time. It does not change.

Just like the verse which we are just now discussing, He says that "It does not matter in whatever occupation you are. Simply you have to change your consciousness. You are now guided by the consciousness of self-interest, of sense gratification." Self-interest. Not exactly self-interest because we do not know what is our self-interest. Rather sense interest, not self-interest, but sense interest. Whatever we are doing, we are doing for satisfying the senses. This consciousness has to be changed. We have to satisfy Kåñëa. That consciousness has to be invoked and then our life will be successful. Thank you very much. If there is any question, you can put. Yes.

Mr. Goldsmith: It's not dedicated to Kåñëa?

Prabhupäda: Yes.

Mr. Goldsmith: The work is not dedicated to Kåñëa.

Prabhupäda: Yes.

Mr. Goldsmith: How, specifically, how can you do this?

Prabhupäda: Yes. Now, this consciousness, "How can I do it?", this is also Kåñëa consciousness, that one is ready. (laughs) Now, just like anything which we do or act, we take some consultation. Just like you are a lawyer, and anything has to be done lawfully, we have to take your consultation because you are expert. Similarly, you have to take consultation from the person who is Kåñëa conscious. It is simple thing.

Mr. Goldsmith: Well, first of all, if you want to find peace, don't you have to believe that war is wrong, any kind of war?

Prabhupäda: Yes.

Mr. Goldsmith: The Bhagavad-gétä teaches that there is a good war and a bad war.

Prabhupäda: Yes.

Mr. Goldsmith: And a little bit like, later on, the Crusades.

Prabhupäda: Yes.

Mr. Goldsmith: It was a holy war, and it was looked on as a good war and existed for a good purpose.

Prabhupäda: Yes.

Mr. Goldsmith: Kåñëa believed that it was all right to kill the enemies of Arjuna because it was a righteous war.

Prabhupäda: Yes.

Mr. Goldsmith: Now, if you have a philosophy like that, can you find peace?

Prabhupäda: What do you mean by peace then?

Mr. Goldsmith: Absence of war.

Prabhupäda: Not necessarily. Not necessarily. Absence of war is not peace. Just think over. Suppose now there is no war. Do you think that everybody is in peace? Ask any individual person that "Are you in peace? Are you in peace of mind or peace of..." No war is not only the cause. There are many other causes which disturbs our peace. War is one of the causes. So simply if you stop war that does not mean peace is guaranteed. No. War is one of the disturbing things of peace. But there are many other disturbing things, many, incalculable, which will disturb you. You see? So we have to take relief from all disturbing position. War is one of the items. And that can be done when you are Kåñëa conscious.

Mr. Goldsmith: Well, how can it be done if you're Kåñëa conscious and Kåñëa Himself was a proponent of war?

Prabhupäda: You are speaking of war. The war has nothing to do...

Mr. Goldsmith: Well, the Bhagavad-gétä starts out with a war.

Prabhupäda: Yes, but... That's all right, but that war was a necessary thing. You cannot, I mean to say, completely eradicate war from the social life. Just like government maintains the law and order force. There is necessity. Why the government maintains so much police force and military force? There is necessity.

Mr. Goldsmith: Well, if you believe, if you believe that it's necessary...

Prabhupäda: When the... Yes.

Mr. Goldsmith: Then that's the end of the discussion because if you believe it's necessary, then Kåñëa believes it's necessary.

Prabhupäda: Yes, yes.

Mr. Goldsmith: Then...

Prabhupäda: Everything is necessary, but whole... Our position is that, so far our material existence is concerned, that there are so many things that... But one thing, or the four things, janma-måtyu-jarä-vyädhi, that we are under the entanglement of repeated birth, death, diseases and old age, these four things does not depend on war or peace. Suppose there is no war. Can you get free from diseases? Suppose there is no war. Can you get free from death? Suppose there is no war. Can you become, remain a young man all the time? No. Your problem is these four things. You have to solve that thing. Janma-måtyu-jarä-vyädhi-duùkha-doñänudarçanam. Bhagavad-gétä says that this war or no war, that is no question. So long the human society will be there, there will be sometimes fighting, sometimes peace, sometimes... That is another thing.

The whole problem is that a learned man sees that "My problem is that I don't want to die. Why there is death? I don't want to be old man. Why I, there is old age?" These are... These are the problems. Real problem, these are the problems. Janma-måtyu-jarä-vyädhi-duùkha-doñänudarçanam. A learned man, a man of real knowledge, he should see that "I am..." Not only war. Suppose there will be excessive heat. Oh, I am so much disturbed. There is no peace. Oh, there is excessive snowfall, cold. Oh, I am disturbed. So there are so many disturbances. So we have to get free from all disturbances. Because I do not want it, my nature does not tolerate these things, but I have been forced to tolerate.

That is your problem. That can be solved by Kåñëa consciousness. We are talking the wholesale solution, not a particular thing. There are so many disturbing things, especially they are under the headings of these four principles: janma-måtyu-jarä-vyädhi-duùkha-doñänudarçanam. So... Mad-dhäma gatvä. Just the other day we discussed the çloka, that tyaktvä dehaà punar janma naiti mäm eti kaunteya: [Bg. 4.9] "Now, one who becomes Kåñëa consciousness, then the result will be that just after quitting this body, he comes to Me, no more coming to this material world." So long you'll be in the material world... Material world means so long we'll have this material body, we'll have to face so many disturbances. War is one of them. Suppose there is, perpetually, there is no war. Do you mean to say there will be perpetual peace? No. There are so many other things. At once, if there is some upheaval in the Atlantic Ocean, the whole thing is swallowed up, your beautiful New York City will be no more there. There are so many natural disturbances. What to speak of war, what you have...

Mr. Goldsmith: Bhagavad-gétä speaks of war. It started out with a war.

Prabhupäda: No, what... Bhagavad-gétä says... Bhagavad-gétä does not say that stop war. Bhagavad-gétä says stop your repeated birth and death. Bhagavad-gétä is not concerned with the war principle. The war will remain so long the human society is there. How can you stop it?

Mr. Goldsmith: Well, some people don't believe that it's necessary.

Prabhupäda: Some people, they foolishly believe. Because, so long the human society will continue, there is no history that there was no war in the history. So war there will be.

Mr. Goldsmith: Well there's never been in history that everyone has accepted Kåñëa either, and yet you...

Prabhupäda: No, you do not think that... Of course, when you are Kåñëa conscious, when you are not in this material world, then there is no question of war also. My point is that war is not only the only disturbing principle. There are many other disturbing principles. So we have to make a wholesale solution of all principles. That is the point.

Kértanänanda: War is only a symptom.

Prabhupäda: Yes. War is also one of the... Just like a man diseased, he eats something, sometimes say, "Oh, doctor, I am feeling some headache." "Oh, all right, take some, this pill." Just like I see advertisement, "Oh, you are feeling strain? Take this pill." "You are feeling this? Oh, take this pill." Just like Post Office. Just like Post Office. All letters should be given to the post box, and it will go in different places. So doctor is prescribing like that. But a real doctor he'll see what is the disease there. And if that disease is cured, then he'll have no headache, no leg, pain leg, no, nothing of the sort.